Please read this , I typed all that, i hope you read it
"I said things that I see them as I find them, " so now you should agree with me since you take things as you see them1) The verse he quoted, jesus one of his disciple philip asked him: " Lord, show us the Father" and Jesus said:" since i've been among you, don't you know me. anyone who has seen me has seen the Father."
considering how you look at things you are saying father and jesus are the same person ( contridicts number 1)
2) 1st verse of John 14, jesus says : " Trust in God; trust also in me", There are 2 different persons.
contridicts with number 1
3) 1 John 4.12
12No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.
no man hath seen god , very clear if we take it as it was said right
again contridicts with number 1
4) john 6.45,46
45It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
46Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
so are all the ones who have seen jesus from god????
so how can you say
" I am sorry King, but it is you who are delusional"
if you have not studied your own bible??
also "I said things that I see them as I find them, not what have been passed on from scholars and priests, which obviously is the case for you."
The bible is not meant to just be read and taken as what you say, you study it as a whole and not just pick what you want out of it , because if you do that it will contridict each other as i have shown you
John 20.17:
" do not hold on to me, go instead to my brothers, my disciples and tell them, I am returning to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God."
what does that mean?????
For example Jesus clearly says to Mary from Magdala in John 20.17:
" do not hold on to me, go instead to my brothers, my disciples and tell them, I am returning to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God."
And the verse 1 John 5.20
It doesn't give to Jesus the right to divinity
verse says this " we know that the Son of God has come, to give us the knowledge of the truth, and we are in the truth in his Son Jesus christ He is the true God and the eternal life
What does that mean?
Pay attention now
if you take this verse in a litteral meaning,
you will directly contredict with the words of jesus himself in John 17.3 where he says addressing to god " The eternal Life is for them to know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent."
Jesus is saying about God that he is the true god and that he is just a messenger of God
Didn't he say that he was the way?
no one goes to The Father, who does not go through him
He is the way not the destination,
Way to the airport isn't the airport
isn't that right?
People are just victim of the system created by the catholic church, the " christocentrism".
Meaning we have to interput the bible int he light of Jesus
I suggest you study the bible and not just read it
Peace to you
5 comments:
1) Yes they are the same person. Jesus, the father and the Holy Spirit are part of holy trinity which escapes all Muslims. When Jesus walked the earth he was both a man and when he rose up from his death and ascended unto heaven he became God.
2) If you trust in God you have to trust in Jesus, or if you trust in Jesus then you have to trust in God. Please read the entire to realize the divinity of Jesus "1"Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God[a]; trust also in me. 2In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. 4You know the way to the place where I am going."
3) I like how you quote 1 John 4 but you failed to read the begining of this chapter. "1Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world." Also read verse 14, 15, and 16.
4) Again you didn't bother to read the entire chapter as a result you misinterpret. "43"Stop grumbling among yourselves," Jesus answered. 44"No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. 45It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.'[d] Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me. 46No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father. 47I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life. 48I am the bread of life. 49Your forefathers ate the manna in the desert, yet they died. 50But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which a man may eat and not die. 51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world."
Question for you: Most of verses you have quoted here states that Jesus talks about himself as the son of God, so do you agree that he is then, since you have been quoting these? Doesn't that go against everything Islam teaches?
One other thing to point out is that in John 14 Jesus said "5 Thomas said to him, "Lord, we don't know where you are going, so how can we know the way?"
6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him."
- In other words Jesus is a reflection of God, his mirror image on earth. Once again you decided to leave the verse at that "Jesus is the way" and hence are claiming that he is not the destination. How can you say that when in the verses just before these Jesus says," 1 "Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God; trust also in me. 2 In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. 4 You know the way to the place where I am going."
- Destination King is with God, and the only way to God is through Jesus and knowing Jesus is like knowing God, seeing Jesus is like seeing God so why is this such a difficult concept for you to fathom?
In John 17 again you make the mistake of looking at one verse and not reading the entire chapter. In this chapter Jesus is praying as a human being with divine powers that can only come from God "1 After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: "Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. 2 For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him. 3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent. 4 I have brought you glory on earth by completing the work you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began."
The last line sums it all when it comes to the question of Christ's divinity. Doesn't it? Yet you don't believe?
Another very interesting chapter which relates to the question "if Jesus is God then who was he praying to?" is Hebrews 2
Answer because he was also fully man! read this chapter and understand.
What makes Muslims believe that the Quran is not written by Prophet Muhammad? Does the Quran claim that it is from God? Could the Prophet have copied some portions of the Bible? Are there scientific facts in the Quran?
Muslims believe that Prophet Muhammad is not the author of the Quran. God is its Author. The following points bear the fact:
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First of all, the Quran itself, at a number of places and in different ways, says that it is from God. One of the claims runs thus: "This is indeed a Quran most honourable, a Book well-guarded...a Revelation from the Lord of the Worlds." (Quran 56:77-80)
(Here, one ought to know the features of the Quran to understand the claim better. For instance, if the Quran had consisted of a number of books, and each book was made up of a number of chapters, then each of the books had to claim that it was from God in order to render the WHOLE volume as coming from God. But, this is fortunately not so with the Quran. The Quran is just ONE Book made up of 114 chapters. So, if the Quran claims, in any of its chapters, that the Book is from God, then the WHOLE Quran is from God. Yet, the Quran does not make the divine claim only once, but several times in different phrases and in different chapters.)
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If the Prophet had written the Quran _ a Book par excellence _ surely he would have claimed credit for it, but he did not. He could not claim what was not his. Indeed God says: "This Quran is not such as can be produced by anyone other than God." (10:37)
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The Prophet was unlettered. However, even if he was educated and had written the Quran, how could he be bold enough to make this statement: "Do they not consider (ponder over) the Quran (with care)? Had it been from other than God, they would surely have found therein discrepancies". (4:82)
Abdullah Yusuf Ali, commenting on this verse (verse 4:82) in his English translation of the Quran, says: "From a mere human point of view, we should have expected much discrepancy, because (1) Prophet Muhammad who promulgated it was not a learned man or philosopher, (2) it was promulgated at various times and in various circumstances, and (3) it is addressed to all grades of mankind. Yet, when properly understood, its various pieces fit together better than a jigsaw puzzle even when arranged without any regard to chronological order. There was just the One Inspirer and one inspired."
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The Quran took 23 years to complete. Had the verses of the Quran (which contains 6,666 verses) been written by the Prophet, he would have needed a number of drafts and the work would have needed editing, updating, etc. But this did not happen, yet the information is consistent throughout the Quran. The verses were taken down as dictated by the Prophet only once and no redrafting, editing or updating took place after that.
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At a number of stages during the 23-year period, challenges to reproduce, even a chapter of the Quran, were made. If the Prophet had written the Quran, he would not have made the challenges, for fear that the learned
Arabs and eminent poets of his time would have taken up his challenges and shamed him. One of the challenges goes thus: "And if you are in doubt as to what We have revealed (from time to time) to Our servant (Muhammad), then produce a chapter like thereunto..." (2:23)
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The Quran says that the Prophet was not learned.
So, if the Prophet was educated in some institution but mentioned in the Quran that he wasn't, he would have been accused of being a liar and his mission would have fallen through.
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Even if the Prophet was learned, how could he have written such an inimitable Book of Information and Wisdom without resorting to consultation with prominent scholars and the best books from the best libraries in the world?! If he did this, it would surely have been known, since every move he made was known to people. The Prophet was a historical figure, not a mythological figure.
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The Prophet was the busiest and most active person in history. So, how could he have found the time to write (even if he were educated) such a comprehensive and extensive Book of Guidance which would have needed years of seclusion and concentration to complete?
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In the Quran, in Chapter 111, it is mentioned that Abu Lahab, one of the Prophet's uncles who was always against Islam, would never accept Islam. This Revelation came some ten years before the death of Abu Lahab. How could the Prophet have dared to write this chapter because all he (Abu Lahab) needed to do to prove that the Quran was not the Words of God, was to accept Islam dishonestly?
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The Prophet was mentioned by name in the Quran only five times whereas Jesus Christ's name was (honourably) mentioned 25 times. Could the Prophet go to such an extent of honouring someone more than himself if he had written the Quran?
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There is a chapter in the Quran entitled and dedicated to "Mary", the mother of Jesus Christ, while there is no chapter called, or dedicated to, the Prophet's own mother, Aminah, or daughter, Fatimah, nor were their names mentioned in the Quran. Could this have happened if the Prophet was the author of the Quran?
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Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ, is glorified in the Quran as a "woman of all nations". Why would the Prophet glorify a woman he had never seen and one from another race, saying that she was chosen (by God) above all women unless the formulation of the verses had nothing to do with the Prophet's own authorship but that he only repeated what was inspired to him by God?
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In the Quran, God is called "Allah" (in Arabic). He is also referred to by His Attributes, like the Cherisher, the Merciful, the Almighty. There are 99 such Attributes but none of these is "Abba" (Father) by which the Arab Christians of the Prophet's time (and even today) refer to God. If the Prophet was the writer of the Quran, he would surely have used "Abba" as one of the names for God because of its familiarity and also because it was easier to say "Abba" than many of the Attributes.
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Although the Quran's objective is basically religious, it does touch on certain principles and laws governing the universe. A French scientist, Maurice Bucaille, in his book, "The Bible, the Quran and Science", says: "What initially strikes the reader confronted for the first time with a text of this kind (the Quran) is the sheer abundance of subjects discussed: the Creation, astronomy, the explanation of certain matters concerning the earth, and the animal and vegetable kingdoms, human reproduction ...I could not find a single error in the Quran. I had to stop and ask myself: if a man was the author of the Quran, how could he have written facts in the 7th Century AD that today are shown to be in keeping with modern scientific knowledge?''
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The Quran mentions a number of scientific facts which were unknown to the world then. Some of them are:
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The moon has no light of its own and that what we see is the reflected light of the sun. (91:1-2),
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The universe came about by a "big bang" or disintegration billions of years ago. (21:30),
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Every living thing began in water. (continuation of 21:30),
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Stages of reproduction of a life in the womb.(22:5),
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Every living thing, including vegetable matter, is created in pairs (male and female). (36:36),
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All celestial body (namely, moon and planets) have their own course of orbit. (7:54 and 21:33),
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Space travel is possible. (55:33), and
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There is also life (in whatever form) in other parts of the universe. (42:29).
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All these scientific facts were discovered only in the last couple of centuries whereas the Quran mentions them 14 centuries ago. How could the Prophet, even if he were educated, have known these fact centuries ahead of recent times?
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Learned Arabs and other experts in the Arabic language acknowledge that the style, diction and rendering in the Quran far excels those in the Hadith. Those in the Quran are inimitable, proving that the Quran is authored by God.
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Umar, later to become Caliph, had wanted to kill the Prophet because of his (Islamic) teachings. One day, Umar heard his sister reading something _ the sound, diction and meaning of which made him halt to listen. His sister, who had secretly converted to Islam, was reading (part of) the Quran. Umar realised that the Words he was listening to could not be the words of man. He submitted to Islam soon after.
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The Quran says: "If the whole of mankind and jinns (spirits) were to come together to produce the like of this Quran, they could not produce the like thereof even if backed up by each other with help and support." (17:88) This is a bold statement indeed. If the Prophet had written the Quran, would he as a human being, dare make such an explosive statement? Would this statement go unchallenged by the learned Arabs of his time?
Prophet Muhammad, being an unlettered person, could not have written the Quran, a Book full of wisdom and one dealing with varied subject matters. The Quran categorically states: "This Quran is not such as can be produced by anyone other than God. (It is a Book) from the Lord of the Worlds." (10:37)
Why do Muslims refer to the Quran as a living miracle?
Many of God's Prophets in the past had performed miracles either to prove that they were sent by God or to help people to achieve certain goals. However, as these miracles were for certain people of the time of the respective Prophets, they are neither tangible nor available today as a living proof. But the Quran is. It is a miracle by itself. When people asked Prophet Muhammad what miracle he had performed, the Prophet pointed to the Quran.
Muslims regard the Quran as a living miracle because, among other reasons, it:
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Is a Book par excellence in the provision of complete guidance for this life and the Hereafter,
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Is available in the language (Arabic) as revealed to the Prophet,
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Is inimitable in diction, sound and rendering,
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Is accurate in its presentation of facts,
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Has remained pure (without interpolation),
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Has no contradiction or inconsistencies,
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Has influenced the lives of people, and
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Is responsible for the speedy spread of Islam, even now.
With regard to the Quran being a miracle from the point of view of its influence on people, Maulana Muhammad Ali in his book, "The Religion of Islam", says: "The Quran is a miracle because it brought about the greatest transformation that the world has ever witnessed _ a transformation of the individual, of the family, of the society, of the nation, of the country, an awakening material as well as moral, intellectual and spiritual. It produced an effect, a hundred thousand times greater than that of any other miracle recorded of any Prophet; hence, its claim to be the greatest of all miracles is uncontestable and uncontested."
Researches on the Quran have been made throughout these 14 centuries. More particularly, in recent years, in the wake of religious enquiries, Quranic scholars, scientists and mathematicians have each, in their own way and knowledge, discovered that the factual contents of the Quran as well as the arrangement of its Words and text point to the fact that the Quran is indeed the living miracle of Islam.
Why do Muslims refer to the Quran as a living miracle?
Many of God's Prophets in the past had performed miracles either to prove that they were sent by God or to help people to achieve certain goals. However, as these miracles were for certain people of the time of the respective Prophets, they are neither tangible nor available today as a living proof. But the Quran is. It is a miracle by itself. When people asked Prophet Muhammad what miracle he had performed, the Prophet pointed to the Quran.
Muslims regard the Quran as a living miracle because, among other reasons, it:
*
Is a Book par excellence in the provision of complete guidance for this life and the Hereafter,
*
Is available in the language (Arabic) as revealed to the Prophet,
*
Is inimitable in diction, sound and rendering,
*
Is accurate in its presentation of facts,
*
Has remained pure (without interpolation),
*
Has no contradiction or inconsistencies,
*
Has influenced the lives of people, and
*
Is responsible for the speedy spread of Islam, even now.
With regard to the Quran being a miracle from the point of view of its influence on people, Maulana Muhammad Ali in his book, "The Religion of Islam", says: "The Quran is a miracle because it brought about the greatest transformation that the world has ever witnessed _ a transformation of the individual, of the family, of the society, of the nation, of the country, an awakening material as well as moral, intellectual and spiritual. It produced an effect, a hundred thousand times greater than that of any other miracle recorded of any Prophet; hence, its claim to be the greatest of all miracles is uncontestable and uncontested."
Researches on the Quran have been made throughout these 14 centuries. More particularly, in recent years, in the wake of religious enquiries, Quranic scholars, scientists and mathematicians have each, in their own way and knowledge, discovered that the factual contents of the Quran as well as the arrangement of its Words and text point to the fact that the Quran is indeed the living miracle of Islam.
Why do Muslims refer to the Quran as a living miracle?
Many of God's Prophets in the past had performed miracles either to prove that they were sent by God or to help people to achieve certain goals. However, as these miracles were for certain people of the time of the respective Prophets, they are neither tangible nor available today as a living proof. But the Quran is. It is a miracle by itself. When people asked Prophet Muhammad what miracle he had performed, the Prophet pointed to the Quran.
Muslims regard the Quran as a living miracle because, among other reasons, it:
*
Is a Book par excellence in the provision of complete guidance for this life and the Hereafter,
*
Is available in the language (Arabic) as revealed to the Prophet,
*
Is inimitable in diction, sound and rendering,
*
Is accurate in its presentation of facts,
*
Has remained pure (without interpolation),
*
Has no contradiction or inconsistencies,
*
Has influenced the lives of people, and
*
Is responsible for the speedy spread of Islam, even now.
With regard to the Quran being a miracle from the point of view of its influence on people, Maulana Muhammad Ali in his book, "The Religion of Islam", says: "The Quran is a miracle because it brought about the greatest transformation that the world has ever witnessed _ a transformation of the individual, of the family, of the society, of the nation, of the country, an awakening material as well as moral, intellectual and spiritual. It produced an effect, a hundred thousand times greater than that of any other miracle recorded of any Prophet; hence, its claim to be the greatest of all miracles is uncontestable and uncontested."
Researches on the Quran have been made throughout these 14 centuries. More particularly, in recent years, in the wake of religious enquiries, Quranic scholars, scientists and mathematicians have each, in their own way and knowledge, discovered that the factual contents of the Quran as well as the arrangement of its Words and text point to the fact that the Quran is indeed the living miracle of Islam.
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